testing one. two. three.  testing. one. three. over, over, over, mickey knox meeting.
showtime.
hello mickey. we've never been introduced, but i'm wayne gayle. i don't know if you've ever heard of me or remember me. i was one of the reporters outside the courthouse during your trial---
i could say the same thing about you. i want to thank you very much for seeing me.
i have a television show. it's very popular. every week we do a profile on a different serial killer. you don't mind if i call you a serial killer, do you?
the episode we did on mickey and mallory was one of our most popular ones.
yes.
yours.
yes. yours got the larger nielson share.
what i'd like to do---
manson beat you.
we've been waiting to do a follow up episode on you for a long time. and that time has definitely come. i feel it's apparent to anyone who's hip to what's going on that the prison board has thrown the constitution straight out the fuckin' window. you and mallory may be killers, but you're not insane. you belong in a prison, not in an asylum. the prison board is blatantly railroading you into a hospital for the sole purpose of turning you into vegetables. now some people are saying, 'so what?' i am not one of those people. if we avert our eyes while they do this to you, we give them permission to do it again whenever they see fit. today they wipe clean your mind because they feel your actions are dangerous, tomorrow they wipe clean my mind because they feel what i say is dangerous. where does it all stop?
my problem mickey, is that you don't exactly inspire empathy. i'm all alone on this. i need your help. i want what the prison board is doing to be the focus of our follow up episode. now i have interviews with chairman of the prison board dewight mcclusky about this issue. and i'm tellin' ya, mickey, he looks bad. the two psychologists they used for their psychiatric kangaroo court won't talk to us, which always looks bad. i have an interview with both the judge of your trial, bert steinsma, and the psychologist and author, emil reinghold, both of which discount the notion that you're insane. you put that all together, and what the state is doing becomes obvious. but the network isn't satisfied. they feel the show needs another element. it needs you. in order to put the show on the air, i need to get an interview with you. you haven't talked to the press since your trial. now, a few days before you get transferred to an asylum, you grant an interview on television with wayne gayle. we're talkin' a media event here. every son of a bitch out the with a tv set's gonna tune in to see that. we'll make their motives so blatant, we'll shame 'em into dropping the whole thing. at least for a little while, the publicity would keep them from just giving you and mallory lobotomies. well, whatta ya say?
she won't even see me, mickey. now you're not supposed to know anything about what's going on with her, but i'm gonna tell ya somethin'. since you two've been sentenced, mallory hasn't spoken one word.
not to anybody. she sings.
songs. 'he's a rebel', 'leader of the pack', 'town without pity', that dusty springfield song 'i only want to be with you'. that's what i hear anyway. her behaviour was the main thing the doctors' report used against you. so even if she would see me, which she won't, i couldn't put her on camera anyway. if i ask her, 'mallory, are you insane?' and she starts singing 'dead skunk in the middle of the road', that blows our whole case.
wait a minute, mickey, i need an answer.
just think about it. but don't think too long.
'after taking a few days to reflect on your offer, i've come to the conclusion that you are one hundred percent correct. a national tv interview would be very advantageous to both mallory and i. the only obstacle is they're shipping me out to the funny farm in four days. however, that is your problem and not mine. i feel confident you'll manage. here's to us making television history. sincerely, mickey knox.'
am i a god or what?
drink up! this is a celebration. this is the day we received word we were gonna make television history. we're gonna have the first sit down, in depth interview with the most charismatic serial killer ever, one day before he's being shipped to a mental hospital for the rest of his life. this is one of those golden moments that happens maybe only four times in a lucky journalist's career. this is wallace with noriega, this is elton john confessing his bi-sexuality to the rolling stone, this is the tearful reporting of the hindenberg disaster, this is truffaut setting the record straight on hitchcock, this is a robert capa photo, this is woodward and bernstien meeting deep throat in an underground parking lot, this is john reid reporting 'the ten days that shook the world', this is the hippies' bloody palms at kent state, the maysles brothers at altamont, this is the nixon. frost interviews.
we got tonight and tomorrow to get our shit together. the day after that they're shippin' mallory. that's when we do the mickey knox interview, 'cause the next day he goes.
are you kidding? the last thing they expected was mickey knox to get up close and personal. they wanted a follow up episode and would've taken anything i had given them. i'm not gonna tell mickey knox that. i'm gonna make him think his grey matter depends on it. when i told woody and the brass about this coup, they practically shit a brick. i'm talkin' an adobe brick. they want to expand the show to a hour, and they want it on immediately.
next week's episode.
rape and pillage the first episode, just change the order a bit. those sons of bitches out there ain't gonna know the difference. all that shit is just filler for the interview anyway. we film a new intro. show some old footage from the first episode so the get a brief history of mickey and mallory. we introduce a new angle.  what the prison board is up to. we see some of that new shit, then the rest of the show is the interview. now what's so fuckin' hard about that? oh, julie make a note: i need woody to get me thirty seconds of the 'live at five' broadcast to promote next weeks show. we'll do a feed right from the jail while we're wrapping up with mickey.
you too scott, betacam and a remote, keep it simple.
i see. high contrast sixteen millimetre black and white, and i mean black and white, where the black's black and the white's white. this is for posterity, so fuck video. film! film! film!
so unruly julie's comin' with me and planning the interview. you two go down to the editing bay, take the old footage and the new footage, put it together, and see what we got. get it into shape so when we finish the interview, we can just stick it in.
tomorrow.
at that point i'll ask him if he believes in god. if he says yes, i'll ask him what he thinks god would make of his actions. and is he worried about burning in hell? if he says no, i'll say, 'well, mickey, what do you believe in?' and hopefully he'll say something like a live round of ammo, the expression on the face of a man he just split up the middle, mallory's eyes, sex, drugs, and rock 'n roll. he's bound to say something provocative.
okay, boys, let's have it.
okay, let's see it.
i hear ya. play.
hello. welcome to 'american maniacs'. i'm your host wayne gayle. and this is highway 58.
to some the fastest distance between point a and point b. to others a beautiful stretch to the american landscape. but to mickey and mallory knox, it was a candy land of murder and mayhem.
after living a very routine, drab, nothing out-of-the-ordinary-ever- happens kind of life, the sweethearts shocked the entire nation with a cross-country crime and murder spree that lasted only three weeks, but left---
---forty-eight known bodies in its wake. including---
---mallory's very own parents.
they started their crime wave in los angeles.
and they were finally apprehended here at this circle k in st. paul, minnesota.
they started off robbing 7. 11 type stores and gas stations and later graduated to banks and the big time.
mickey and mallory's idea of an armed robbery was a little different than most. it was an assault, actually.
they'd storm in with shotguns, and kill every customer in the place right off the bat.
sick, isn't it? after killing numerous people, the would always leave one clerk alive. one clerk. to give them the money, and tell the tale of---
mickey and mallory.
patrolman gerald nash was just one of the twelve peace officers that mickey and mallory murdered during their reign of terror.
gerald and his partner dale wrigley were parked at.
this donut shop, alfie's donuts. when---
apparently bored with banditry and murder, the two outlaws proved what renaissance psychopaths they really are. to break up the monotony in between bank jobs, or what have you, they started butchering whole households at random.
unfortunately, the story didn't end with their capture. it just became more surreal. their subsequent trial turned into a sick circus.
as spectators, reporters, law students, tourists, gawkers, the interested, the curious, the devoted, and the demented were drawn to the los angeles county courthouse like moths to a flame.
the mickey and mallory knox murder trial was so event filled it made the crime spree that took place before pale by comparison. the first point was the decision of mickey's to act as his own council. now this in itself is not unheard of, for instance, ted bundy acted as his own council as well. what was unexpected was how well mickey's performance would be.
we spoke with burt steinsma, who was the presiding judge during the knox trial.
however, this opinion isn't shared by the state's prosecutor on this case, wanda bisbing.
judge steinsma said that mickey showed up very prepared and proved to be an excellent amateur attorney.
the nation caught fire to mickey and mallory fever, mickey and mallory mania, if you will, as the merits to mickey's talent as a defence attorney became apparent. law students from all ends of the country converged on los angeles as legal history took a new course. but that was only the lemon next to the pie. and that pie is you, the american people. that pie is the way the strangely charismatic, and make no mistake, they are charismatic, mickey and mallory have captured the public's interest, fear, and in some cases, admiration.
what do you think of mickey and mallory?
what do you think of mickey and mallory?
yes.
tell me, mr. vossler, how many days of the trial have you attended?
and you being a harvard law student, what is your opinion of mickey knox's performance?
you're talking about a man and a woman who killed innocent people.
what do you think of mickey and mallory?
but how can you say that?
yes.
yes.
you say this and yet. you two are both victims of mickey and mallory.
how can you say that you 'admire' them?
why can't they just shake hands and be friends?
and they made the first move?
why?
how so?
but you'll never be whole again.
one last question. usually mickey and mallory kill all of their victims. why did they let you two survive?
the couple proved so popular that a motion picture glamorizing their exploits was made.
the movie 'thrill killers' proved to be a tremendous box office success, making stars out of the before then unknown---
---actors jessie alexander warwick and buffy st.mcqueen.
we talked with neil pope, writer and director of 'thrill killers' for his take on the mickey and mallory phenomena.
why did you kill mallory? both of them are still alive.
did you meet the real mallory knox?
you met mickey knox, didn't you?
to get a psychiatric view on the strange attraction mickey and mallory seems to have, we talked with doctor emil reinghold, noted psychologist and author.
can you shed some light, doctor reinghold, on why the public has taken a pair of sociopaths so close to their bosom?
this attitude from the young towards their ultimate anti-heroes is nation wide. and spreading.
and as to almost give this whole misplaced admiration scenario a cherry on the top, the rock band redd kross entered the charts last week at number 13 with their song 'natural born killers, the saga of mickey and mallory.'
the third wicked twist to this story is grace mulberry.
of the six teens murdered that night, seventeen year old grace mulberry was the lucky one left to tell the tale. and this haunted young lady summoned up the courage to take the stand, tell what she saw that horrible night, and then allow herself to be cross-examined by the man who killed her brother and girlfriends.
how do you feel about mickey cross- examining you?
mickey, how do you feel about cross- examining grace mulberry?
no, apparently we had not seen everything. grace mulberry gave her tearful testimony. then it became mickey knox's turn for cross- examination.
after the deadly brewhaha in the courtroom, the judge, honorable burt steinsma, passed down a sentence that was to make legal history.
we spoke with retired judge steinsma at his home in baltimore, maryland.
was there any vengeance on your part with your unique sentence?
would you please describe for our viewers what your sentence was?
the sentence was never to reach that point. because after only a year, mickey and mallory created so much mayhem that it was decided.
that they were mentally ill and needed to be transferred to a state mental hospital.
we talked with dewight mcclusky, chairman of the california state prison board, about this curious turn of events in the mickey and mallory case.
why are mickey and mallory being moved to an asylum? and who made the decision?
mickey and mallory were deemed competent in a mental examination before their trial. i'm confused. what's changed?
when they were found competent before, they had already killed fifty people. other than the fact they're a disciplinary problem, which frankly shouldn't surprise anyone, i still don't see where this situation is any different then it was before. so, i ask you again, mr. mcclusky, what's changed?
who is we?
were any of the doctors who made the first evaluation on the knoxs mental state asked to re-examine them?
i take it by your answer it was a whole new team?
the two psychiatric opinions the board sought were those of albert rodriguez.
and dr. felix vargus. both of the good doctors, for whatever reason, refused to be interviewed.
so, in your opinion mickey and mallory are not insane?
good work, my brothers. fan-fuckin'- tastic! i think that interview stuff's too long, we can lose some of that. keep the girls, keep the long hairs, keep the hun brothers, keep the black guy, keep the movie shit, and keep the cop at the donut shop. lose the rest. and cut the interview with the prison board fellow before that. cut it after i ask, 'i take it by your answer it was a whole new team.' don't even let him answer. fuck him. then cut to me talking about the two chicken shit psychiatrists and straight in dr. reinghold laughing.
children, we have a show. you two get some long well overdue sleep. 'cause tomorrow, bright and early, county jail and then journey's end. mickey knox.
how's it working, scotty?
you were there. did you see him put it in a box?
you can't be serious?
huh uh. this dozen is for mickey.
roger, no.
roger, do you understand what the word 'no' means? it's important we establish a rapport. something as simple as a dozen donuts can mean the world to somebody who hasn't had a donut in a year.
okay, guys, we're here. l.a. county jail. julie, just park in the front.
roger, i'm starting to get pissed. just drop this fuckin' donut shit, and gather your gear.
here's the welcome wagon.
same here. let me introduce my crew. scott. roger. and unruly julie . this is. i'm sorry. what's your title again?
that sounds great. look, i don't want any of this to intimidate you. this is not going to be a big deal. this is going to be very easy. i need to talk with mr. wurlitzer. you guys get your equipment ready, power up the van and confirm a transmission code for the remote. julie come with me.
the main thing i need is a big room, shut off from the population, so we can get some privacy. with a few electrical outlets.
we're gonna be talking over here. but i want enough freedom so if i wanna get up and move around, we can.
take him and walk him over this way. so, mickey, killing mallory's parents, what the hell was that all about? then maybe take him to the window.
so, mickey, if you were let outta jail today, what's the first thing you'd do? little shit like that. i don't wanna have to feel i gotta stay in the chairs. we're after a cinema verite, anything can happen, truth twenty-four times a second kindda feel.
everything's coming along just fine. phil, i wanted to know if i could have a small word with you.
you met the kids i have working for me? great bunch, aren't they?
scott, genius cameraman, roger, magician with sound. unruly julie, i could sooner do without my arm than unruly julie.
just a little nickname. yep, they're my kids and they're all i need. after working together these past coupla years, we're like well-oiled machinery. no, more like a formula race car. no, scratch that one, too. what we're really like is a swiss watch. small, intricate, compact. it shouldn't work as well as it does, but it does. because of the craftsmanship, the expertise, and the artist's loving hand.
now, phil, i don't know if you've ever been on a set before---
really?
well. small world. well, then, you know firsthand how hollywood does things. lights all over the place, generators, a hundred and fifty crew members---
see what i mean? it's a funny business, isn't it?
they got a asshole over here. a asshole sitting down reading a magazine over there. a asshole perched up there. assholes everywhere. hey, maybe if we were doin' that kiss, kiss, bang, bang stuff we'd need all those assholes, too. what we're about is intimacy. we're about two people having a conversation. say i was interviewing you. all i want you to worry about is what i ask you. i want a trust to develop. if you're thinking about all this.  . you're not going to relax, a trust won't develop, we'll be talking a each other instead of to each other, there will be no chance for intimacy.
that's why my crew is only three. an invisible three. which brings me to what i wanted to talk to you about. i have to get mickey knox to relax. mickey knox to share what he's never shared before.  mickey knox to open doors which 'till today have been closed. well, how can we expect him to do that when we got los angeles county sheriffs up the walls.
lose 'em.
mr. wurlitzer, i assure you, i am very familiar with mickey knox's career.
don't recite the fact to me. i'm sure i know 'em better than you do.
one. i can take care of myself. i grew up in a tough neighbourhood, and i've handled some pretty rough customers in my day. mickey knox doesn't scare me. two. i'm a journalist, and i'm prepared to take that risk. three. it ain't gonna happen. believe me when i tell you, it is in mickey knox's own best interest to play this game according to hoyle. wait a minute. we've gotten into a advisory relationship here, which is not what i want. but seriously, phil, look at this.
we got one. two. three. four . five. six. seven. eight. i mean jesus christ, phil, that's too much. let's lose some of these guys.
phil, i'm just scared he's gonna clam up on me with all these sheriffs all over the place. they hate him. he hates them. what kinda intimacy am i gonna create with all this hate in the air. even you and i feel it.
two guys?
no, no, no, no, no, no, i mean only two guys.
three.
and when he gets here, its no dick'n around time. make him up, clip a mike on him, then leave him alone. i don't want you talking to him. i don't want you getting in his face. i want you hiding behind your gear. you are invisible.
okay, break.
all right, mickey.
so we got a deal. four deputies---
why don't we make it three deputies and you?
chill out, phill. four deputies and you, i can live with that. we're about ready to go here, so let's get rid of these other assholes.
i didn't mean they were assholes. i mean if they're leaving, get 'em outta here.
okay, scotty, we're stuck with four of these assholes. now i want to create the illusion that this is just mickey and i chewin' the fat all by ourselves. so make sure you don't film these assholes. i don't want to see 'em on film ever. oh, and 'live at five' slated our spot as human interest which means we'll go live at just after five-thirty.
roger, enough with the fucking donuts! what did i tell you. stop bothering mickey, and get behind your nagra.
sorry about that.
we're about ready to go here. are you ready?
okay people! let's start to settle down here.
are you comfortable?
roger?
scotty?
slate it.
so, mickey, tell us what you do for fun.
yes. aside from the obvious.
what? oh, aaahhh, what you did for fun for starters.
do you miss mallory?
then was it worth it?
was massacring all those people worth being separated from your wife for the rest of your life?
no, mickey, i can't let you get away with that shit. answer the question. was it worth it? you haven't seen, heard, or smelled mallory in a year. was it worth it?
excuse me, did you say an instant of purity? what was the instant of purity? the bodies you left behind on your bloody trail?
please explain to me, mickey, where's the purity that you couldn't live without in five year old danny millhouse's blown off head? where's the purity in forty-eight people who are no longer on this planet because they met you and mallory? what's so fucking pure about that?
fucking dammit! mickey hold onto that thought. reload, quick!
roll it. save the slate.
you just said an instant of purity was preferrable to a lifetime lie. i don't understand. what's so pure about forty-eight dead bodies?
tell me about the purity.
okay. okay. i'll buy that. we'll move on and come back later.
describe mallory.
don't play dumb with me, mickey. you know what i mean. describe mallory. what's up here? what's in here?
well, riddle me this, batman. how do you feel about the fact that you're never gonna see mallory again?
says the united states of america.
okay, let's cut it.
did ya get that?
super cool. this is great stuff. how ya doin'?
could i get a coke for mickey?
fine. julie, why don't you make a food run? what's around here?
okay, julie, take everybody's order. i'll have a double double with cheese, french fries, and a large coke.
could we go with you and film it?
sure.
let me check on scott. he's hurt bad.
this is wayne gayle reporting live from the los angeles county jail, where you can tell from the bloody carnage behind me that the final chapter in the book called mickey and mallory has not yet been written.
yeah, we have a van.
out front.
mickey, can i talk to you alone?
this is crazy. you can't escape like this.
we'll all be killed.
don't shoot. i beg you, don't shoot! please, please, please.
what would i do? me and my network would sue the entire los angeles county sheriffs department for flagrantly disregarding my safety. i'd go straight to my buddy, the mayor, and make sure everyone of those son of a bitches down there ends up on the unemployment line. in fact, i'd sue every man down there personally. i would make it my life's ambition to bring the la county jail to its knees. i would do expose after expose on the brutality, and the conditions, and the inhumanity that exists here.
on average forty million.
are you kidding? the golden globe, the edward r. murrow award.
yes.
got it.
my name is wayne gayle! i am the star of 'american maniacs', watched by forty million people every week! i am a respected journalist, winners of the golden globe, the edward r. murrows award among others! if anybody puts me in danger, my network will sue the los angeles county sheriffs department. my estate will sue every officer personally who fires. the network's law firm is rowlands, davis and sinclair.
this is wayne gayle. i'm wounded and my crew, roger and scott, are dead. this may be out of sync 'cause we are shooting with a wild camera and a standard recorder we found in the van. mickey knox's plan worked. we walked out the front door, into my news van and made our getaway. when we were followed by patrol cars, mallory knox killed deputy sheriff duncan homolka and tossed his body out of the back. mickey told authorities over my police band that i would surely be next if they didn't give up the pursuit. they took mickey at his word and called off the pursuit. why helicopters weren't employed, i don't know. my only thought is it all happened too fast for arrangements to be made. we've just pulled off to the side of the road to do this interview. tensions run high--
without any further ado, mickey and mallory.
mallory, what did you think of mickey's plan? did you think it would work?
what did you think then?
did you have anything to do with the riot in the laundry room?
try to keep it to a minimum.
so, what now?
how do you intend to disappear? you're probably the most famous couple in america.
okay, just let me swing around and film myself asking the questions. and then i'll do my little wrap up.
that's a joke right?
just wait one fucking minute.
wait! i don't know, but i kinda felt during this. this whole escape that a kind of bond--
developed between the three of us. we're kindda in this together, don't ya think?
don't touch those triggers! please. i think i've already proven that a live wayne gayle is much more better that a dead. way-- gayle. i was your passport out of jail, not duncan homolka. but me! i'll be your passport outta---
wait! you can't kill me. mickey and mallory always leave somebody alive to tell the tale.
no!!!